Questions & Answers

Add an option for quantizing from beginning of transient rather than end

+26 votes
439 views
asked Aug 15, 2016 in Studio One Feature Requests by scmrecordings (1,460 points)
Hi, new user from Sonar Platinum and Pro Tools here.  Studio One generally seems awesome but there are a few things, coming from these other DAWs, that seem like huge deficiencies.  One of them is the way Audio Bend markers are placed.

As it is now, when you quantize an audio file, it uses the Audio Bend markers (which are placed late to protect transients I guess) rather than the beginning of the transients.  This makes it so that when you quantize a track, everything is early (and not by a consistent amount).  This doesn't make any sense when you need a 100% quantized track.  When you Split at Bend Markers, it splits the audio in exactly the right spot so it's clear that this is possible.  From a few google searches, it seems like people have been asking about this for years.

My question is why not just add the Audio Bend marker at the beginning of the transient and then leave the highlighted area after it?

My follow up is, if this is not possible, it would save everyone using quantize and Audio Bend a huge amount of time if we were given the option to quantize from the beginning of the Audio Bend transient.  I can't speak for everyone, but it would save me hours per song.

6 Answers

+4 votes
answered Aug 22, 2016 by AlexTinsley (695,320 points)
selected Dec 11, 2016 by ghasenbeck
 
Best answer

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+1 vote
answered Nov 24, 2016 by Scoox (8,490 points)
edited Nov 24, 2016 by Scoox

I may be wrong but I think you are mistaken. I've just checked what you describe here and read the relevant section in the user manual:

If Bend Markers have been inserted as the result of transient detection, a very short, highlighted range—visible if zoomed in far enough—precedes the Bend Marker. This range represents the entirety of what has been detected as a transient, and it is important when Studio One quantizes audio based on Bend Markers.

The far left of the highlighted range IS the start of the transient, and if you grab the highlighted range with the bend tool, like I did in the following animated screen capture, you see that stretching happens to the left and right of the start of the transient, not to the left and right of the displayed bend marker.

On the animation you can see how the waveform changes red when bent to the right, and you can see clearly that the red color includes the highlighted transient range, to the left of the bend marker.

I must admit the way transient bend markers appear at the end of the transient range rather than at the start (left) can be confusing, so my request to Presonus devs would be to place transient bend markers precisely on the start of the transient range, which I think most people would find more intuitive.

Cheers

+5 votes
answered Sep 5, 2017 by mrjshyne (450 points)
I need this option ASAP. This the only reason i don't use Studio one full time because of the transient detection/quantizing Audio design. Pro tools and Logic places the transient at the beginning, making it a quick and simple process to quantize audio whether it is Piano or organic drum material. I would play a 16th note piano line and when I quantize it the notes be starting to early because of the way Studio One quantizes Audio, I I could just have the Option to have the Marker be at the actual beginning of the transient that would be great, and then the way Studio One quantizes now could be for a "Time Stretch Mode or something".
+3 votes
answered May 28 by robertgray3 (16,950 points)
edited May 30 by robertgray3

For clarification: the people asking for this feature are concerned about quantizing, not timestretching. I don't really think there's anything wrong with how the timestretching handles transients, just where they quantize to. See the latest discussion here: https://forums.presonus.com/viewtopic.php?f=151&t=30445

My two cents: keep the system where the transient range is preserved, but add an option to shift the bend marker position to one of three places - the START (as said in the FR) of the range, the END or PEAK of the range (as in the current behavior), or a PERCENTAGE of the range (0% for the beginning, 50% for the middle, 100% for the end)

The idea being that for busy percussive material “Start” allows you to quantize from the very beginning of the transient range the way that you would with a MIDI-triggered sampler, and “End/Peak” allows the current behavior which is preferable for vocal and instrumental material. Then for experimenting with timing you can use the PERCENTAGE.

Call it something spiffy like "Transient Timing" :D

+6 votes
answered May 29 by emeraldescape (430 points)
Been using studio for the past 4 years now and still waiting for this to be fixed as well.  I have to bring my session into Pro Tools 11 to edit my drums and then bring them back to after I’m done editing them.  This would be a life saver if Presonus would fix this where it detects the wave at the beginning of the transient.  It’s a waste of my time to edit all these here which is why I’ve had to use P11.  Looking forward to a fix.  Let’s get tons of votes for this one!
+2 votes
answered May 29 by robertgray3 (16,950 points)
edited May 30 by robertgray3
Here’s some additional background on this that can clarify the request from forum discussions on this over the last few years:

REQUEST: Add an way to adjust where autodetected transients are quantized from, ideally in the Audio Bend menu. The ideal option would be a PERCENTAGE range with the BEGINNING OF THE TRANSIENT RANGE selectable at one end (0%) and the END/PEAK OF THE TRANSIENT RANGE selectable at the other end (100%) - 100% would reflect the current behavior. Call it something sexy like "Transient Timing" if you want.

REASON FOR REQUEST: Some users want to be able to have consistency with other forms of quantization and programmed material that overwhelmingly quantize from the beginning of the “transient range” or the “sample start” if you are using programmed drums. With no automatic way to do this in the Audio Bend system, users either have to do it manually (see below) or use another program and re-import the audio. The benefit of a variable system is that the current system (which works better for some audio) can be preserved, the standard system for other DAWs can be used, and anything in between if the user wishes to "loosen" the timing as it aligns to the grid or the groove template.



For comparison, SLICED audio bend material, Studio One’s own MIDI Sequencer and Pattern Editor, Sonar, Cubase, Logic, and Melodyne all quantize the beginning of the “transient range”. Not having this option means that Audio Bend’s quantized notes will always be early by whatever the detected “transient range” amount is, relatively speaking. It may be barely noticeable with a very fast attack but the longer the attack is the earlier the notes will be in comparison. And if an engineer is performing work for someone else in another DAW, any tracks they quantize with Audio Bend will deviate from the rest of the project.

Please see this screenshot for a comparison of various acoustic hi hat hits, quantized in Audio Bend, Sonar, and Melodyne. The Audio Bend quantized hits are always early by a variable amount. Some users would prefer a way around this.

Hat tip to Niles:



Now, just to show, this the work that must be done manually to correct this. Doing this too many times is not fun at all :)

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